Sliding out problem

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Finalmushroom
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Sliding out problem

Post by Finalmushroom »

Can anyone help me figure this out?

I think what I'm doing is leaning the bike over too far and it's causing it to slide.
Stiffen my dampening settings? Leveling and it's dampening? Steering strength decrease?
Whenever I move my settings it feels too stiff.
It's to the point where I've reached a plateau in game because I can't push as hard as I want to or I'll slide. It's also prohibiting me in doing triple in's because I slide coming out of the corner too much.
Maybe it's a suspension issue that's causing my rear end to push out?

Any suggestions would be wonderful!
P.S. I will continue to play and work on being smooth but I'm more looking for advice and if it's a set up issue or If it's me (I'm sure it is) let me know.



-Jake
Finalmushroom
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Re: Sliding out problem

Post by Finalmushroom »

I did just try decreasing my fork rebound 5 points and it helped a ton.
I normally run a lot of low speed fork rebound.
DABZZZ
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Re: Sliding out problem

Post by DABZZZ »

This is just to my understanding and Im also assuming you understand the leveling and roll damping, But the roll limit angle is is the angle your bike gets to before your roll limit factor kicks in which is additional roll damping.

Also - My woman just walked up to my computer while I was typing that and was like "sliding out problem?".... 15 seconds later, "maybe thats not something he shouldn't be posting on the mx sim forums' hahahahahaha bout killed me.
IG:@mxs.battlegrounds
Finalmushroom
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Re: Sliding out problem

Post by Finalmushroom »

DABZZZ wrote:This is just to my understanding and Im also assuming you understand the leveling and roll damping, But the roll limit angle is is the angle your bike gets to before your roll limit factor kicks in which is additional roll damping.

Also - My woman just walked up to my computer while I was typing that and was like "sliding out problem?".... 15 seconds later, "maybe thats not something he shouldn't be posting on the mx sim forums' hahahahahaha bout killed me.
Lol, even your girl knows dudes get roasted on here! Nah I could careless. Most of the dudes talking shit on the forums wouldn't say it to my (and anyone else's) face anyways. I could care less if a teen who still lives with his mother and has been playing the game since 08 talks shit. lol.

So you'd recommend increasing that roll limit number which would give me more dampening sooner, causing me to slow down the roll a little sooner (I'm pretty sure it compounds as well like the more I'm leaned over the less traction and the less amount of help holding me up as well), in turn making me not slide out and get more traction? I'm pretty sure this is a run on sentence but I'm not a English major so whatever. lol. I hope that makes sense??
Hi Im Skyqe
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Re: Sliding out problem

Post by Hi Im Skyqe »

Seems like your stability is too loose for you. Going higher on roll dampening will slow it down but like you say it will make it tighter everywhere. There are obviously many of ways of skinning the cat with how you can tailor a stability 'tighter' but at the end of the day the biggest thing is just getting used to a stability and sticking with it. What you gain in one area you will lose in another. This is why there isn't really a go to stability that all fast people use as it is all user preference.

If you like how your stability feels at higher speeds and is just too loose at low speeds, you can raise your slow dampening speed. Another thing you could be overlooking is throttle control, you may be simply sliding from losing traction in some cases.

Running a higher low speed rebound just means you are running a more digressive rebound. You will notice a bigger difference adjusting the high speed rebound.
Finalmushroom
Posts: 515
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Re: Sliding out problem

Post by Finalmushroom »

Hi Im Skyqe wrote:Seems like your stability is too loose for you. Going higher on roll dampening will slow it down but like you say it will make it tighter everywhere. There are obviously many of ways of skinning the cat with how you can tailor a stability 'tighter' but at the end of the day the biggest thing is just getting used to a stability and sticking with it. What you gain in one area you will lose in another. This is why there isn't really a go to stability that all fast people use as it is all user preference.

If you like how your stability feels at higher speeds and is just too loose at low speeds, you can raise your slow dampening speed. Another thing you could be overlooking is throttle control, you may be simply sliding from losing traction in some cases.

Running a higher low speed rebound just means you are running a more digressive rebound. You will notice a bigger difference adjusting the high speed rebound.
I didn't know if you could get a similar feel with say tightening up rolling dampening vs decreasing steering strength or even dampening. I've played with them a bit isolating variables changing one and a time and of course they seem to be all scaled differently so it takes different clicks in each to achieve a similar feel.

As far as losing traction I think I turn the tire too much causing my tire footprint to decrease which causes me to slide. I'm sure the amount i turn and how I quickly "snap" the tire causes me to lose traction. Which is why I felt it was a stability problem (And of course user error) and not so much a suspension problem.

You really think I would notice more of a difference with high speed? I think it depends on what I set my FPS speed to. Right? Like if I have a really high speed and in this corner I'm going slower than that then my low speed should be the one to adjust? Unless I'm not understanding correctly which defiantly could be the case.

But, like I said I did decrease my low speed fork rebound by 5 and it helped me a ton. I think the rebound kept pushing the fork up as I was slowing down which wasn't allowing the front end to settle causing it to push.

I did play with the slow speed factor when I first started but settle with this one. If I go even one click (Which I think is only .25%) makes it feel too stiff. And again I could move my speed around for when I want this to enable as well as adjust my roll and strength settings slightly to get me to a sweet spot.

Lastly, could my Body mass be an issue why she slides? I run mine low (Which you would think would help my case) at .43. I'm sure all of the other variables are at play here but it seems to me like a lot of dudes run > .47.

I'm more or less struggling finding a setting where I feel is loose and flowly feeling yet doesn't allow my initial input to turn the tire too much. :mrgreen:

-Jake
Hi Im Skyqe
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Re: Sliding out problem

Post by Hi Im Skyqe »

Finalmushroom wrote:I didn't know if you could get a similar feel with say tightening up rolling dampening vs decreasing steering strength or even dampening. I've played with them a bit isolating variables changing one and a time and of course they seem to be all scaled differently so it takes different clicks in each to achieve a similar feel.

As far as losing traction I think I turn the tire too much causing my tire footprint to decrease which causes me to slide. I'm sure the amount i turn and how I quickly "snap" the tire causes me to lose traction. Which is why I felt it was a stability problem (And of course user error) and not so much a suspension problem.

You really think I would notice more of a difference with high speed? I think it depends on what I set my FPS speed to. Right? Like if I have a really high speed and in this corner I'm going slower than that then my low speed should be the one to adjust? Unless I'm not understanding correctly which defiantly could be the case.

But, like I said I did decrease my low speed fork rebound by 5 and it helped me a ton. I think the rebound kept pushing the fork up as I was slowing down which wasn't allowing the front end to settle causing it to push.

I did play with the slow speed factor when I first started but settle with this one. If I go even one click (Which I think is only .25%) makes it feel too stiff. And again I could move my speed around for when I want this to enable as well as adjust my roll and strength settings slightly to get me to a sweet spot.

Lastly, could my Body mass be an issue why she slides? I run mine low (Which you would think would help my case) at .43. I'm sure all of the other variables are at play here but it seems to me like a lot of dudes run > .47.

I'm more or less struggling finding a setting where I feel is loose and flowly feeling yet doesn't allow my initial input to turn the tire too much. :mrgreen
:
-Jake
I would play with the speed first before adjusting the factor. You may want to try a few different peoples stability setups. Sometimes this can give you a better idea of what you want out of a stability or you can find one that you really like.

The low speed adjustment doesn't work like that. A easier way to understand it is, high speed is your static compression adjustment and the low speed manipulates the high speed adjustment relative to shaft speed. The low speed adjuster changes the curve of the dampening from 0-49 (progressive) 50 (linear) and 51-100 (digressive) relative to speed. The further away from 50 you are in either direction, the more drastic the change is.

Picture YZed made to give a better understanding:
Image
Finalmushroom
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Re: Sliding out problem

Post by Finalmushroom »

Hi Im Skyqe wrote:
Finalmushroom wrote:I didn't know if you could get a similar feel with say tightening up rolling dampening vs decreasing steering strength or even dampening. I've played with them a bit isolating variables changing one and a time and of course they seem to be all scaled differently so it takes different clicks in each to achieve a similar feel.

As far as losing traction I think I turn the tire too much causing my tire footprint to decrease which causes me to slide. I'm sure the amount i turn and how I quickly "snap" the tire causes me to lose traction. Which is why I felt it was a stability problem (And of course user error) and not so much a suspension problem.

You really think I would notice more of a difference with high speed? I think it depends on what I set my FPS speed to. Right? Like if I have a really high speed and in this corner I'm going slower than that then my low speed should be the one to adjust? Unless I'm not understanding correctly which defiantly could be the case.

But, like I said I did decrease my low speed fork rebound by 5 and it helped me a ton. I think the rebound kept pushing the fork up as I was slowing down which wasn't allowing the front end to settle causing it to push.

I did play with the slow speed factor when I first started but settle with this one. If I go even one click (Which I think is only .25%) makes it feel too stiff. And again I could move my speed around for when I want this to enable as well as adjust my roll and strength settings slightly to get me to a sweet spot.

Lastly, could my Body mass be an issue why she slides? I run mine low (Which you would think would help my case) at .43. I'm sure all of the other variables are at play here but it seems to me like a lot of dudes run > .47.

I'm more or less struggling finding a setting where I feel is loose and flowly feeling yet doesn't allow my initial input to turn the tire too much. :mrgreen
:
-Jake
I would play with the speed first before adjusting the factor. You may want to try a few different peoples stability setups. Sometimes this can give you a better idea of what you want out of a stability or you can find one that you really like.

The low speed adjustment doesn't work like that. A easier way to understand it is, high speed is your static compression adjustment and the low speed manipulates the high speed adjustment relative to shaft speed. The low speed adjuster changes the curve of the dampening from 0-49 (progressive) 50 (linear) and 51-100 (digressive) relative to speed. The further away from 50 you are in either direction, the more drastic the change is.

Picture YZed made to give a better understanding:
Image
Hmm. I'll have to play with this and really think about the graph. It's a simple concept but getting a setting that works is the hard part.
Hi Im Skyqe
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Re: Sliding out problem

Post by Hi Im Skyqe »

It's not very hard. :wink:
Finalmushroom
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Re: Sliding out problem

Post by Finalmushroom »

Hi Im Skyqe wrote:It's not very hard. :wink:
Lol, I could act like I fully understand and I'm an expert but I'm a humble son of a beeetch. :D
Finalmushroom
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Re: Sliding out problem

Post by Finalmushroom »

Hi Im Skyqe wrote:It's not very hard. :wink:
Here's another quick shot.
I lose traction right as I go to make the turn. I do think I went for a V turn and maybe that's why I lost traction but I've rewatched it a few times and I feel like:
1. I didn't turn my wheel too fast up setting my traction or losing my front end.
2. I wasn't engine braking to the point where my rear end would come loose (When I went from 4th to 3rd to 2nd I was braking and by the time I hit 2nd I was at about 8k). I think the KTM redlines around 14K so I'm only half.
3. I don't think I entered the corner too fast causing the slide (IMO maybe I'm wrong).

I don't know. Not a big deal but I like to figure out and really understand what's going on and why.
When the bike does things I'm not thinking it will I have a problem with that!



-Jake
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