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Traction

Posted: Thu Oct 12, 2017 5:14 am
by Finalmushroom
Hello all,

I've attempted to look into traction in this to fully understand it will help me ride better.

In this game the low speed traction seems slippery but when you're at speed its wonderful (Track conditions obviously vary).
But if you come into a tight, slow corner you seem to lose the front wheel and then of course are those funny times when the front tire just locks and slides like an ass hat. Why is the traction set up like this? Is it some kind of negative to have the traction at higher speeds feel the way they do?

Note: I'm not crying about the traction and please don't mention how back in your day (2011) when the tracks were like glass. lolol. I can't stand that shit. I'm just trying to fully understand the games physics is all so be civil.

Love,

Jake

Re: Traction

Posted: Fri Oct 13, 2017 12:52 am
by jlv
If the traction is set to ramp up at higher slip speeds* you'll get there quicker if the bike is moving fast since a small slip at high speed will result in higher slip speed that it would at a lower speed.

* "slip speed" meaning the speed of the contact patch in relation to the ground, where zero would be no slip at all.

Re: Traction

Posted: Fri Oct 20, 2017 6:08 pm
by Finalmushroom
I appreciate!

That's what it seems in game. But I'm still curious, why?
Is this just the way that the engine in game works?
I feel like in real life as the speeds increase the traction decreases (to an extend obviously). If you're going too slow you tend to lose traction with wheel spin but on the other end of the spectrum going really fast, especially over bumps and through ruts, tends to promote a twitchy bike which is more prone to change directions over these said bumps when going at a very high rate of speed.

There's probably some sort off science that you understand that I don't with the contact patch and how speed affects that patch with the effects of gravity and the rotation of the tires applying their mass to the ground.

-Jake

Re: Traction

Posted: Sat Oct 21, 2017 1:03 am
by jlv
The system is designed for modeling a mix of static and viscous friction. So most tracks will use settings that start high for the static friction, then dip down as the static friction breaks, then ramps up again as viscous friction takes over.

One of these days I'm going to try dragging a tire around with a pull scale and see if I can get some real numbers that way.

Re: Traction

Posted: Mon Oct 23, 2017 11:57 pm
by cameron312
jlv wrote:The system is designed for modeling a mix of static and viscous friction. So most tracks will use settings that start high for the static friction, then dip down as the static friction breaks, then ramps up again as viscous friction takes over.

One of these days I'm going to try dragging a tire around with a pull scale and see if I can get some real numbers that way.


What will doing this do as far as in game? make the traction more realistic because you know the real life specs?

Re: Traction

Posted: Tue Oct 24, 2017 12:35 am
by jlv
Pretty much. I'd be recording the lateral force at different speeds so I could use the numbers in the tileinfo file.

Re: Traction

Posted: Tue Oct 24, 2017 6:05 am
by Finalmushroom
Got it I understand.

I wonder if you could look into talking to professional teams rep to see if they have any sensors that measure that. I'm sure it'd be hard to get it out of them because they use that information for testing and adjusting their bikers, but I feel like they have to have something to the affect. At least the amount of G's that could possibly give you a starting point.

Better yet, maybe we'll see it perfected with the new AMA game coming out. :roll:

-Jake