1st person view x 3rd person view

[Motoboss]

I can see where your coming from but you have to realize this is a video game not real life...In car racing games you really dont rely on the feel of the car so much...Riding a dirt bike cannot be compared to car racing at all ...When your on a dirtbike you rely on the feel of the bike ,whats going on underneath you ...Whats the rear of the bike doing....is it kicked sideways a little or alot ? ...how high is it? ...The only way to know is 3rd person view ...Not being able to know these things is not simulation...

Just my thoughts of course...

[surfboyrio]

I think is more a matter of adaptation to understand reaction of the camera and bike tuning can make the 1st person view enjoyable.
Funny thing is that I have that same you feeling you described when I try 3rd person view, not with the rear but the front wheels.
I try sometimes ride on 3rd person view, but i think much of the software immersion is lost on 3rd person , so that's why i prefer stick to 1st.

[Servatis]

I can see where your coming from but you have to realize this is a video game not real life...In car racing games you really dont rely on the feel of the car so much...Riding a dirt bike cannot be compared to car racing at all ...When your on a dirtbike you rely on the feel of the bike ,whats going on underneath you ...Whats the rear of the bike doing....is it kicked sideways a little or alot ? ...how high is it? ...The only way to know is 3rd person view ...Not being able to know these things is not simulation...

Just my thoughts of course...

All the things you mention I can "feel" in 1st person view. by the angel of the camera I can see how far the rear is swinging out, i can see how high or low my rear wheel is. I can see the position of my handle bars and front wheel.
When you ride motocross in real life do you constantly look behind you to see where the bike is? probably not. by looking at the angle of the camera and the position of my handle bars etc I know what the rear end is doing.

however when you ride 3rd person. you cant see what the front end is doing. you can only guess.

when I ride in 1st person, and i'm in the air doing a whip. I can line up my front wheel exactly in line with the direction i'm moving. making for an easy and smooth landing. I would like to see any 3rd person rider lining up the front wheel perfectly 100% of the time.

the point of this thread however is that it's not true simulation if you ride in 3rd person. 1st person isn't true simulation either but it comes much closer.
3rd person does have advantages. and saying that it would only be fair to allow both is bullshit. If this game did not come with 3rd person and you would have all learned to ride in 1st person, you would laugh at someone requesting 3rd person for a simulator game.

The fact that some people can't ride in 1st person is because they never really tried. if they had they would notice that you can get a much better "feel" for the bike.
The fact that I can't see some things does not mean I don't know where they are.

I realize jlv is not going to remove 3rd person. since that would make a lot of people angry. but in my opinion he made a big mistake by putting it in the game to start with.

P.S. I have nothing against anyone, I'm just not very fond of the 3rd person option in this game.

[Pumaxcs]

I use first person and rode in races just fine. Been around this game longer than 3rd person has, so for me 3rd person is the alien.

[surfboyrio]

I realize jlv is not going to remove 3rd person. since that would make a lot of people angry. but in my opinion he made a big mistake by putting it in the game to start with.

P.S. I have nothing against anyone, I'm just not very fond of the 3rd person option in this game.

My suggestion is not to remove 3rd person view, but to add a line on the multilayer config file allowing the host to set or force the riding View.

EX:
Forced Riding View="0" /
/ 0=no restrictions on driving view,
1= 1st person/Free cam only

[Motoboss]

I can see where your coming from but you have to realize this is a video game not real life...In car racing games you really dont rely on the feel of the car so much...Riding a dirt bike cannot be compared to car racing at all ...When your on a dirtbike you rely on the feel of the bike ,whats going on underneath you ...Whats the rear of the bike doing....is it kicked sideways a little or alot ? ...how high is it? ...The only way to know is 3rd person view ...Not being able to know these things is not simulation...

Just my thoughts of course...

All the things you mention I can "feel" in 1st person view. by the angel of the camera I can see how far the rear is swinging out, i can see how high or low my rear wheel is. I can see the position of my handle bars and front wheel.
When you ride motocross in real life do you constantly look behind you to see where the bike is? probably not. by looking at the angle of the camera and the position of my handle bars etc I know what the rear end is doing.

however when you ride 3rd person. you cant see what the front end is doing. you can only guess.

when I ride in 1st person, and i'm in the air doing a whip. I can line up my front wheel exactly in line with the direction i'm moving. making for an easy and smooth landing. I would like to see any 3rd person rider lining up the front wheel perfectly 100% of the time.

the point of this thread however is that it's not true simulation if you ride in 3rd person. 1st person isn't true simulation either but it comes much closer.
3rd person does have advantages. and saying that it would only be fair to allow both is bullshit. If this game did not come with 3rd person and you would have all learned to ride in 1st person, you would laugh at someone requesting 3rd person for a simulator game.

The fact that some people can't ride in 1st person is because they never really tried. if they had they would notice that you can get a much better "feel" for the bike.
The fact that I can't see some things does not mean I don't know where they are.

I realize jlv is not going to remove 3rd person. since that would make a lot of people angry. but in my opinion he made a big mistake by putting it in the game to start with.

P.S. I have nothing against anyone, I'm just not very fond of the 3rd person option in this game.

Like i said ,there my thoughts ...Theres no way in first person that you know the exact position of the rear wheel...You would only be making geusses or what the bike is doing underneath you..For example a difficult opsticle like whoops..This is all where feel of the bike comes in...As I said in above post..I still stand behind everything I said...
I have nothing against first person if thats what your good at then use it ...

[Kawasakis]

I realize jlv is not going to remove 3rd person. since that would make a lot of people angry. but in my opinion he made a big mistake by putting it in the game to start with.

P.S. I have nothing against anyone, I'm just not very fond of the 3rd person option in this game.

My suggestion is not to remove 3rd person view, but to add a line on the multilayer config file allowing the host to set or force the riding View.

EX:
Forced Riding View="0" /
/ 0=no restrictions on driving view,
1= 1st person/Free cam only

No. Read what others wrote..

[mace-x]

the 1st cam it´s too enclosed, hence you can see a fuck what´s around you.
i use 3rd cam because what kawa sayd, as you cant really feel it you gotta see it.

how will i see where my bike is facing in a whip without feeling my toes, my arms and my body position?

that´s why i fail at riding mxs in 1st person view.

[Joe]

I agree I cant ride in third person at all I have to ride in first person but i am not saying I am a true simulation rider or Kawa or any other guys that run 3rd person are not because for the simple fact that in order to be a true simulator you need to have manual transition on (and some people just dont have enough buttons) you need to have stop wheelies off ( I do but many dont) and you need to do 35 min motos and fill your gas tank, have tear offs and real time terrain deformation.. you see where im going? if you say people cant ride in 3rd person because its not simulation then we are going to have to re haul the whole game MX Simulator is the MOST realistic simulation of motocross on the market to day but it is far from a complete simulator it is just the best we have..


Just thoughts


Joe

[Phathry25]

I play many car sims from 1st person view and have no troubles at all. However MXS first person makes me dizzy and nauseous. I think it's from the amount of side to side movement in relation from the viewpoint to the ground in MXS that's throw me out of wack.

[Jonee589]

the 1st cam it´s too enclosed, hence you can see a fuck what´s around you.
i use 3rd cam because what kawa sayd, as you cant really feel it you gotta see it.

how will i see where my bike is facing in a whip without feeling my toes, my arms and my body position?

that´s why i fail at riding mxs in 1st person view.

I 100% agree with you, when you use 1st person its hard because you can't feel the bike, but in 3rd you can actually see the bike which makes up for not being able to feel it. However this topic is a waste of time because its a game, everyone should be allowed to choose the way they want to play.

[Servatis]

if you say people cant ride in 3rd person because its not simulation then we are going to have to re haul the whole game MX Simulator is the MOST realistic simulation of motocross on the market to day but it is far from a complete simulator it is just the best we have..

Well. then lets just add preload. and predefined buttons for whipping. go MVA.
saying that it ok for stuff like 3rd person to be around in a simulator because it's not a real simulator isn't much of an excuse.
this is as close as we can get right now to having a simulator for MX. we all love how it gets closer to reality than any other MX game out there. yet people ride in 3rd person. I don't get that.

and once again, about feeling the bike. I can do that just fine in 1st person. If I can do that anyone can. So bringing that up constantly isn't really helping.

However this topic is a waste of time because its a game, everyone should be allowed to choose the way they want to play.

The topic isn't pointless.
Would you allow people to ride around in arcade mode in official championships? you would probably yell at them if they jumped into the 02 server on arcade mode. I know there is a huge difference but i'm just trying to make a point.
The way I see it is that it was a mistake to ever put 3rd person in the game. it kills any kind of simulation there is.
1st person isn't perfect I know, but it's fine once you get used to it. And trust me, 100 times as fun as 3rd person.

I don't think people should be prevented from riding in 3rd person, it has been an option in the game for a long time and people have gotten used to it (sadly), doesn't prevent me from giving my opinion on the matter.
3rd person has advantages and disadvantages. I think the advantages when it comes to racing give an edge to 3rd person riders that isn't completely fair.
however, I myself will never ride 3rd person. It would kill the fun for me.

[Phathry25]

we all love how it gets closer to reality than any other MX game out there. yet people ride in 3rd person. I don't get that.

I play many car sims from 1st person view and have no troubles at all. However MXS first person makes me dizzy and nauseous. I think it's from the amount of side to side movement in relation from the viewpoint to the ground in MXS that's throw me out of wack.

Do you get it now?

[Servatis]

yeah ok thats a good reason. I doubt everyone that rides 3rd person has that though.
like I said jlv is not going to remove the feature, and i'm ok with that.

however a first person only option for championship purposes (which this topic was about originally) would not be a bad idea in my opinion. it would level the playing field even more. and it would not get used in the major championships.

ps. I used to have some problems with getting a bit nauseous playing MXS but I figured out that that was because i was focussing on the creen to much. if I relax and focus on the track there is no nausea for me, since the track is stationary. I think.. i'm not a doctor .

[VMX_SKYmx99]

I have been watching this thread and remaining silent, but now I have questions....

I have been using 3rd person since I bought the game. Last night, because of this debate, I decided to give 1st person a try. I found some settings for the camera in another thread, but I am curious what some of you guys are using for your 1st person camera settings? I can already tell a huge difference in turning ability. I don't slide out or swap in braking bumps near as much because I can see where my front wheel is.

I find myself leaning my head whichever way the bike is leaning. lol Once I get over the sea sickness I think I will be just as fast in 1st person.