2022 MotoOption Supercross Round 17 Salt Lake City

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Jrife548
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Re: 2022 MotoOption Supercross Round 1 Anaheim 1

Post by Jrife548 »

Y'all could just do the obvious thing and stop using asphalt traction and 90 foot triple in's. That would fix the whole burm issue. This is a simulator right?
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Hi Im Skyqe
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Re: 2022 MotoOption Supercross Round 1 Anaheim 1

Post by Hi Im Skyqe »

Jrife548 wrote: Wed Jan 12, 2022 11:26 pm Y'all could just do the obvious thing and stop using asphalt traction and 90 foot triple in's. That would fix the whole burm issue. This is a simulator right?
Few things.

There is zero point at this time for someone to go in depth spending a ton of time reinventing the wheel on traction and erode settings when there are updates coming relating terrain from JLV. When you change traction you need to adjust erode with it. New settings will create growing pains with multiple changes needed to get it right. These settings realistically can only be done in rF races for accuracy.

So with saying this, what is easier and/or more realistic? Change the berm shape slightly or traction and erode? :lol:
roganmx
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Re: 2022 MotoOption Supercross Round 1 Anaheim 1

Post by roganmx »

Hi Im Skyqe wrote: Wed Jan 12, 2022 11:50 pm
Jrife548 wrote: Wed Jan 12, 2022 11:26 pm Y'all could just do the obvious thing and stop using asphalt traction and 90 foot triple in's. That would fix the whole burm issue. This is a simulator right?
Few things.

There is zero point at this time for someone to go in depth spending a ton of time reinventing the wheel on traction and erode settings when there are updates coming relating terrain from JLV. When you change traction you need to adjust erode with it. New settings will create growing pains with multiple changes needed to get it right. These settings realistically can only be done in rF races for accuracy.

So with saying this, what is easier and/or more realistic? Change the berm shape slightly or traction and erode? :lol:
i mean the traction they use is so insanely far from realistic its not even funny. if rf knew what they were doing with traction they would make it slippery and add a little more drag to slow down the speeds to have better racing, but they dont really care and just want everyone to go mach 10 around a supercross track! cus thats super realistic right?
Jakob Hubbard
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Re: 2022 MotoOption Supercross Round 1 Anaheim 1

Post by Jakob Hubbard »

Hi Im Skyqe wrote: Wed Jan 12, 2022 11:50 pm Few things.

There is zero point at this time for someone to go in depth spending a ton of time reinventing the wheel on traction and erode settings when there are updates coming relating terrain from JLV. When you change traction you need to adjust erode with it. New settings will create growing pains with multiple changes needed to get it right. These settings realistically can only be done in rF races for accuracy.

So with saying this, what is easier and/or more realistic? Change the berm shape slightly or traction and erode? :lol:
Honestly all of the above is needed, I feel like these tracks need to take a complete 180 from what they're currently doing because it's just not working. Jlv changing the terrain engine won't change the wheel on traction or any of the erode settings. We need to go back when it comes to traction, change erode accordingly, do what they can to make it better. The more complacent rF gets with what they have and the more they refuse to change the faster it's going to die.
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Jeremy150
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Re: 2022 MotoOption Supercross Round 2 Oakland

Post by Jeremy150 »

First post updated with Oakland
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bh5o
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Re: 2022 MotoOption Supercross Round 2 Oakland

Post by bh5o »

I think you messed up the picture for oakland
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Hi Im Skyqe
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Re: 2022 MotoOption Supercross Round 1 Anaheim 1

Post by Hi Im Skyqe »

Jakob Hubbard wrote: Thu Jan 13, 2022 12:00 am
Hi Im Skyqe wrote: Wed Jan 12, 2022 11:50 pm Few things.

There is zero point at this time for someone to go in depth spending a ton of time reinventing the wheel on traction and erode settings when there are updates coming relating terrain from JLV. When you change traction you need to adjust erode with it. New settings will create growing pains with multiple changes needed to get it right. These settings realistically can only be done in rF races for accuracy.

So with saying this, what is easier and/or more realistic? Change the berm shape slightly or traction and erode? :lol:
Honestly all of the above is needed, I feel like these tracks need to take a complete 180 from what they're currently doing because it's just not working. Jlv changing the terrain engine won't change the wheel on traction or any of the erode settings. We need to go back when it comes to traction, change erode accordingly, do what they can to make it better. The more complacent rF gets with what they have and the more they refuse to change the faster it's going to die.
It has everything to do with it... New visuals making erode more visible will completely change how erode can be used. Decal drops, terrain resolution changes etc... If you go down the rabbit hole that is erode you will know that there are infinite options and ways of erode working differently than it is currently IF we have the visual ability to use it. We are just extremely limited due to visuals.

Testing in the past has been done with restrictive tractions. It can create its own set of problems with more falloffs etc. I am not at all saying what we have now is the best however it is tried and tested and works with the erode settings that have been developed for it.

I think before you guys call out people on complacency you need to realize that people doing this testing and development are doing it as a personal hobby and not for monetary gain. Having new toys to play with can spark interest in wanting to test this stuff..

Not saying this is the case at all but there are always a ton of people saying what they believe needs to be done, but nobody wants to take it upon themselves to do the work in testing. Rogan, go ahead and go back to 2012-2014 time and see what people said about the traction and you will understand why the more traction route was taken. The majority complained about sliding out and feeling like they are riding on ice. All of the resource material when it comes to erode can be found and you have the resource of JLV to bounce questions off of if you are trying to develop something. I truly would like to see more people trying new things and testing traction and erode as I am 100% certain there are improvements to be had. I just feel right now might not be the best time with new changes on the horizon that WILL change how you go about using erode.
brapaj751
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Re: 2022 MotoOption Supercross Round 2 Oakland

Post by brapaj751 »

are they having and issue or did they post the password somewhere else???
taylerbelle
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Re: 2022 MotoOption Supercross Round 2 Oakland

Post by taylerbelle »

I'm not one to complain about tracks at all and haven't played sim in a while but these tracks just suck ass... traction is better :D
BCDesigns
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Re: 2022 MotoOption Supercross Round 2 Oakland

Post by BCDesigns »

imagine paying to get these tracks lmao
motokid499
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Re: 2022 MotoOption Supercross Round 1 Anaheim 1

Post by motokid499 »

Hi Im Skyqe wrote: Thu Jan 13, 2022 12:32 am There is zero point at this time for someone to go in depth spending a ton of time reinventing the wheel on traction and erode settings when there are updates coming relating terrain from JLV.
Nobody wants to reinvent the wheel, frankly I think we need to take a step back and recognize that we are mathematically so far off what we should be running. I don't care how many hours of testing is done to determine what "feels" right, its not right.
Hi Im Skyqe wrote: Thu Jan 13, 2022 12:32 am It has everything to do with it... New visuals making erode more visible will completely change how erode can be used.
This still wont change the fact we are running insanely high traction levels. Peoples skewed reality of what "feels" realistic is a direct result of the lack of force feedback in the game. We have a joystick and visual feedback, if you slide out slow the fuck down. I feel like I shouldn't have to say this but nobody seems to understand it.
Hi Im Skyqe wrote: Thu Jan 13, 2022 12:32 am go ahead and go back to 2012-2014 time and see what people said about the traction and you will understand why the more traction route was taken. The majority complained about sliding out and feeling like they are riding on ice.
They made a mistake, that's our point. we tried it, it made racing worse, and now we have to collectively agree as a community it was a bad idea. We continue to try to find band aids like roll off the top of berms for example, when in reality we are entertaining an old idea that should've been scrapped almost as quickly as it was introduced. How the pavement traction lasted even this long is completely beyond me. I don't enjoy going 5th wicked around a track at speeds close to double that of real life.

Here's something we can all agree on, we all want better closer racing right? If we understand motorcycle racing from a road course standpoint you will notice that there is always going to be an "optimal" line. This is a result of the high traction levels allowing only a small margin of error for "perfect" race lines. If we implement high traction into a motocross simulator, it will create a much smaller margin of error for the ideal racing line, this creates "highways" that are one lined and frankly terrible for racing. Of course now we solve that with overscaling then lets just make the tracks massive for more room to pass. Well now what we've done is create room for higher speeds, inviting even a smaller margin of error for the "ideal" line. Maybe this only makes sense to me and I'm completely off base but I'd say rallycross provides much more close battles than road racing from an ideal line perspective, you have a much wider range of error before losing too much time. This is how motocross is, and how MX Simulator should be.
/endrant

This goes without saying, but I just wanna be able to wash my front end dude. Pls. I'm tired of bar dragging flat ground :(
Tanner Rogers
Hi Im Skyqe
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Re: 2022 MotoOption Supercross Round 1 Anaheim 1

Post by Hi Im Skyqe »

motokid499 wrote: Thu Jan 13, 2022 11:35 am
Hi Im Skyqe wrote: Thu Jan 13, 2022 12:32 am There is zero point at this time for someone to go in depth spending a ton of time reinventing the wheel on traction and erode settings when there are updates coming relating terrain from JLV.
Nobody wants to reinvent the wheel, frankly I think we need to take a step back and recognize that we are mathematically so far off what we should be running. I don't care how many hours of testing is done to determine what "feels" right, its not right.
Hi Im Skyqe wrote: Thu Jan 13, 2022 12:32 am It has everything to do with it... New visuals making erode more visible will completely change how erode can be used.
This still wont change the fact we are running insanely high traction levels. Peoples skewed reality of what "feels" realistic is a direct result of the lack of force feedback in the game. We have a joystick and visual feedback, if you slide out slow the fuck down. I feel like I shouldn't have to say this but nobody seems to understand it.
Hi Im Skyqe wrote: Thu Jan 13, 2022 12:32 am go ahead and go back to 2012-2014 time and see what people said about the traction and you will understand why the more traction route was taken. The majority complained about sliding out and feeling like they are riding on ice.
They made a mistake, that's our point. we tried it, it made racing worse, and now we have to collectively agree as a community it was a bad idea. We continue to try to find band aids like roll off the top of berms for example, when in reality we are entertaining an old idea that should've been scrapped almost as quickly as it was introduced. How the pavement traction lasted even this long is completely beyond me. I don't enjoy going 5th wicked around a track at speeds close to double that of real life.

Here's something we can all agree on, we all want better closer racing right? If we understand motorcycle racing from a road course standpoint you will notice that there is always going to be an "optimal" line. This is a result of the high traction levels allowing only a small margin of error for "perfect" race lines. If we implement high traction into a motocross simulator, it will create a much smaller margin of error for the ideal racing line, this creates "highways" that are one lined and frankly terrible for racing. Of course now we solve that with overscaling then lets just make the tracks massive for more room to pass. Well now what we've done is create room for higher speeds, inviting even a smaller margin of error for the "ideal" line. Maybe this only makes sense to me and I'm completely off base but I'd say rallycross provides much more close battles than road racing from an ideal line perspective, you have a much wider range of error before losing too much time. This is how motocross is, and how MX Simulator should be.
/endrant

This goes without saying, but I just wanna be able to wash my front end dude. Pls. I'm tired of bar dragging flat ground :(
Tanner did you by chance read what I wrote before you went on your bring back Disney on ice tirade? This community is driven off of community created content. People in rF aren't closed minded to change. If you want change then do something about it. It's pretty simple. Put time into making new traction and erode settings instead of complaining. Actually do something, it is great to sit here and tell us about your theory.. DO IT, SHOW IT. I promise you that if you put the time in creating and testing new settings and they were good and people enjoyed them in beta tests I am sure rF would support the change.
TM_Infidel
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Re: 2022 MotoOption Supercross Round 2 Oakland

Post by TM_Infidel »

Bring back the old days, my download folder is hungry.
Rodgers344
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Re: 2022 MotoOption Supercross Round 2 Oakland

Post by Rodgers344 »

I'm actually glad to see everyone else complaining about the last two tracks. I thought I was just struggling but I really feel like the tracks this year feel different than the last couple years.
motokid499
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Re: 2022 MotoOption Supercross Round 1 Anaheim 1

Post by motokid499 »

Hi Im Skyqe wrote: Thu Jan 13, 2022 7:00 pm Tanner did you by chance read what I wrote before you went on your bring back Disney on ice tirade? This community is driven off of community created content. People in rF aren't closed minded to change. If you want change then do something about it. It's pretty simple. Put time into making new traction and erode settings instead of complaining. Actually do something, it is great to sit here and tell us about your theory.. DO IT, SHOW IT. I promise you that if you put the time in creating and testing new settings and they were good and people enjoyed them in beta tests I am sure rF would support the change.
Trust me there's lots being worked on. You'll see.

I'm not saying rF is closed minded, but the community simply will not allow us to move towards "disney on ice". rF seems completely disinterested in trying to ease the community back to reality. I have no doubt rF would be more than happy to test these new settings and hear what we have to say, but the community simply wont allow for that, and that's probably exactly what they'll tell me. I hope we can both agree on that, everyone's reality is too far gone and too far skewed. I'm looking forward for when the rF alternative is launched, then we can have a direct comparison. Understandable that you haven't heard about it though, we are keeping it pretty lowkey.
Tanner Rogers
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