2021 MX Season

I've heard conversation coming out of animal pens that is more intelligent than what is going on in here.
DBRider251
Posts: 1638
Joined: Fri Jun 21, 2013 5:38 pm
Team: LCQ Studios

Re: 2021 MX Season

Post by DBRider251 »

Pumaxcs wrote: Mon Jul 05, 2021 1:07 am The leap was doable but you had to go so far outside that if anyone was racing you'd they'd easily just cut you off. Seeing people behind like Ferrandis doing the leap on someone who didn't made it obvious that going wider made up for it but was just overall too risky.
Yeah, but honestly it's so dangerous to have the lines funnel so that you could possibly land on someone who didn't do it but still faded outside because that's where the line was. It just wasn't a good combination, and I think making the leap completely doable is the safer option.
137 wrote: Mon Jul 05, 2021 3:46 pm
Pumaxcs wrote: Mon Jul 05, 2021 1:20 am The penalties against Dylan and Ken. How could I fucking forget. This abomination of a call, fuck me. Now what makes this such a bad call?
This is what got me. How are you gonna penalize people when the Red Cross flagger was standing on the landing of an almost blind takeoff? Yeah Ferrandis might’ve seen it first since he focused up front, Roczen chasing Ferrandis ducking roost probably seen it last second and it was already to late. Why wasn’t the guy closer to the takeoff?? In my opinion it was a bad call and just hurt Roczen in the end, nothing against Ferrandis just to make that clear.
There was a red cross flag going into the corner, but still doesn't make sense that they were penalized differently.
TeamHavocRacing wrote:it's all the liberals fault
Hi Im Skyqe
Posts: 3008
Joined: Wed Dec 22, 2010 4:52 pm
Team: wat

Re: 2021 MX Season

Post by Hi Im Skyqe »

DBRider251 wrote: Tue Jul 06, 2021 1:18 am
Pumaxcs wrote: Mon Jul 05, 2021 1:07 am The leap was doable but you had to go so far outside that if anyone was racing you'd they'd easily just cut you off. Seeing people behind like Ferrandis doing the leap on someone who didn't made it obvious that going wider made up for it but was just overall too risky.
Yeah, but honestly it's so dangerous to have the lines funnel so that you could possibly land on someone who didn't do it but still faded outside because that's where the line was. It just wasn't a good combination, and I think making the leap completely doable is the safer option.
137 wrote: Mon Jul 05, 2021 3:46 pm
Pumaxcs wrote: Mon Jul 05, 2021 1:20 am The penalties against Dylan and Ken. How could I fucking forget. This abomination of a call, fuck me. Now what makes this such a bad call?
This is what got me. How are you gonna penalize people when the Red Cross flagger was standing on the landing of an almost blind takeoff? Yeah Ferrandis might’ve seen it first since he focused up front, Roczen chasing Ferrandis ducking roost probably seen it last second and it was already to late. Why wasn’t the guy closer to the takeoff?? In my opinion it was a bad call and just hurt Roczen in the end, nothing against Ferrandis just to make that clear.
There was a red cross flag going into the corner, but still doesn't make sense that they were penalized differently.
Yes it does..

You can read about the decision from DC himself on vital if you want. But the difference is explained in the actual rule.

https://www.vitalmx.com/forums/Moto-Rel ... 490?page=1

2.10.b

ii. White and Red Stripe Flag (“Wheels on the Ground” Flag) and or Red and White flashing
lights: Indicates a potentially hazardous situation on or near the racetrack in an area that
is not clearly visible to on-coming riders. Riders must proceed with extreme caution. Both
wheels of the motorcycle must remain on the ground over obstacles until the rider has
passed the area of concern. Passing is NOT allowed. This flag and or flashing red and
white lights takes precedence over all other flags that may be displayed. Penalty for
violation of the flag is loss of one championship point for every 20 feet of air jumped.
DBRider251
Posts: 1638
Joined: Fri Jun 21, 2013 5:38 pm
Team: LCQ Studios

Re: 2021 MX Season

Post by DBRider251 »

Hi Im Skyqe wrote: Wed Jul 07, 2021 2:37 am
DBRider251 wrote: Tue Jul 06, 2021 1:18 am
Pumaxcs wrote: Mon Jul 05, 2021 1:07 am The leap was doable but you had to go so far outside that if anyone was racing you'd they'd easily just cut you off. Seeing people behind like Ferrandis doing the leap on someone who didn't made it obvious that going wider made up for it but was just overall too risky.
Yeah, but honestly it's so dangerous to have the lines funnel so that you could possibly land on someone who didn't do it but still faded outside because that's where the line was. It just wasn't a good combination, and I think making the leap completely doable is the safer option.
137 wrote: Mon Jul 05, 2021 3:46 pm

This is what got me. How are you gonna penalize people when the Red Cross flagger was standing on the landing of an almost blind takeoff? Yeah Ferrandis might’ve seen it first since he focused up front, Roczen chasing Ferrandis ducking roost probably seen it last second and it was already to late. Why wasn’t the guy closer to the takeoff?? In my opinion it was a bad call and just hurt Roczen in the end, nothing against Ferrandis just to make that clear.
There was a red cross flag going into the corner, but still doesn't make sense that they were penalized differently.
Yes it does..

You can read about the decision from DC himself on vital if you want. But the difference is explained in the actual rule.

https://www.vitalmx.com/forums/Moto-Rel ... 490?page=1

2.10.b

ii. White and Red Stripe Flag (“Wheels on the Ground” Flag) and or Red and White flashing
lights: Indicates a potentially hazardous situation on or near the racetrack in an area that
is not clearly visible to on-coming riders. Riders must proceed with extreme caution. Both
wheels of the motorcycle must remain on the ground over obstacles until the rider has
passed the area of concern. Passing is NOT allowed. This flag and or flashing red and
white lights takes precedence over all other flags that may be displayed. Penalty for
violation of the flag is loss of one championship point for every 20 feet of air jumped.
Think you got caught in a troll there.

2.10.ii is "White and Red Stripe Flag (“Wheels on the Ground” Flag) and or Red and White flashing
lights: Indicates a potentially hazardous situation on or near the racetrack in an area that
is not clearly visible to on-coming riders. Riders must proceed with extreme caution. Both
wheels of the motorcycle must remain on the ground over obstacles until the rider has
passed the area of concern. Passing is NOT allowed. This flag and or flashing red and
white lights takes precedence over all other flags that may be displayed. Penalty for
violation of the flag may include but not be limited to, loss of championship point(s)
and/or race position(s), as determined by the Race Director."
TeamHavocRacing wrote:it's all the liberals fault
Hi Im Skyqe
Posts: 3008
Joined: Wed Dec 22, 2010 4:52 pm
Team: wat

Re: 2021 MX Season

Post by Hi Im Skyqe »

DBRider251 wrote: Wed Jul 07, 2021 2:46 am
Hi Im Skyqe wrote: Wed Jul 07, 2021 2:37 am
DBRider251 wrote: Tue Jul 06, 2021 1:18 am

Yeah, but honestly it's so dangerous to have the lines funnel so that you could possibly land on someone who didn't do it but still faded outside because that's where the line was. It just wasn't a good combination, and I think making the leap completely doable is the safer option.



There was a red cross flag going into the corner, but still doesn't make sense that they were penalized differently.
Yes it does..

You can read about the decision from DC himself on vital if you want. But the difference is explained in the actual rule.

https://www.vitalmx.com/forums/Moto-Rel ... 490?page=1

2.10.b

ii. White and Red Stripe Flag (“Wheels on the Ground” Flag) and or Red and White flashing
lights: Indicates a potentially hazardous situation on or near the racetrack in an area that
is not clearly visible to on-coming riders. Riders must proceed with extreme caution. Both
wheels of the motorcycle must remain on the ground over obstacles until the rider has
passed the area of concern. Passing is NOT allowed. This flag and or flashing red and
white lights takes precedence over all other flags that may be displayed. Penalty for
violation of the flag is loss of one championship point for every 20 feet of air jumped.
Think you got caught in a troll there.

2.10.ii is "White and Red Stripe Flag (“Wheels on the Ground” Flag) and or Red and White flashing
lights: Indicates a potentially hazardous situation on or near the racetrack in an area that
is not clearly visible to on-coming riders. Riders must proceed with extreme caution. Both
wheels of the motorcycle must remain on the ground over obstacles until the rider has
passed the area of concern. Passing is NOT allowed. This flag and or flashing red and
white lights takes precedence over all other flags that may be displayed. Penalty for
violation of the flag may include but not be limited to, loss of championship point(s)
and/or race position(s), as determined by the Race Director."
That's what I get when yI don't read the rules myself I guess.. :lol:

DC's explanation is still somewhat valid of the point penalty not being fair if both were punished the same amount along with the fact that Dylan did slow down more than Kenny. Regardless though they need a better way to get the information to the riders than they have now. The flag system and placement of them isn't good enough and hasn't improved as jumps and obstacles have gotten bigger with less time for riders to react or spend looking for them. I think in helmet radio's have to be in the future plans in some way. If the mechanic cannot have access to it and only the race director big deal but something should be done IMO.
DBRider251
Posts: 1638
Joined: Fri Jun 21, 2013 5:38 pm
Team: LCQ Studios

Re: 2021 MX Season

Post by DBRider251 »

Hi Im Skyqe wrote: Wed Jul 07, 2021 4:38 am
DBRider251 wrote: Wed Jul 07, 2021 2:46 am
Hi Im Skyqe wrote: Wed Jul 07, 2021 2:37 am

Yes it does..

You can read about the decision from DC himself on vital if you want. But the difference is explained in the actual rule.

https://www.vitalmx.com/forums/Moto-Rel ... 490?page=1

2.10.b

ii. White and Red Stripe Flag (“Wheels on the Ground” Flag) and or Red and White flashing
lights: Indicates a potentially hazardous situation on or near the racetrack in an area that
is not clearly visible to on-coming riders. Riders must proceed with extreme caution. Both
wheels of the motorcycle must remain on the ground over obstacles until the rider has
passed the area of concern. Passing is NOT allowed. This flag and or flashing red and
white lights takes precedence over all other flags that may be displayed. Penalty for
violation of the flag is loss of one championship point for every 20 feet of air jumped.
Think you got caught in a troll there.

2.10.ii is "White and Red Stripe Flag (“Wheels on the Ground” Flag) and or Red and White flashing
lights: Indicates a potentially hazardous situation on or near the racetrack in an area that
is not clearly visible to on-coming riders. Riders must proceed with extreme caution. Both
wheels of the motorcycle must remain on the ground over obstacles until the rider has
passed the area of concern. Passing is NOT allowed. This flag and or flashing red and
white lights takes precedence over all other flags that may be displayed. Penalty for
violation of the flag may include but not be limited to, loss of championship point(s)
and/or race position(s), as determined by the Race Director."
That's what I get when yI don't read the rules myself I guess.. :lol:

DC's explanation is still somewhat valid of the point penalty not being fair if both were punished the same amount along with the fact that Dylan did slow down more than Kenny. Regardless though they need a better way to get the information to the riders than they have now. The flag system and placement of them isn't good enough and hasn't improved as jumps and obstacles have gotten bigger with less time for riders to react or spend looking for them. I think in helmet radio's have to be in the future plans in some way. If the mechanic cannot have access to it and only the race director big deal but something should be done IMO.
Yeah, I guess it's all pointing to the "as determined by the Race Director" part there.

Didn't we have this discussion in the SX thread when the same shit happened? You're right, it's getting ridiculous. Small town dirt tracks have 1 way radio communication, I really can't see why it hasn't been implemented in our sport yet.

I'm not opposed to 2 way radio communication. Why shouldn't a rider and mechanic be able to talk to each other? I think it's the safest way to communicate there is a problem on track and need to be cautious. I believe racing would improve as well. Win win.
TeamHavocRacing wrote:it's all the liberals fault
137
Posts: 2599
Joined: Wed Jun 24, 2009 1:31 am
Team: LCQ Studios / rF

Re: 2021 MX Season

Post by 137 »

I like the radio in the helmets idea but don’t you think it could potentially cause a distraction? Like imagine being in the zone and next thing is boom “red cross flag coming up” could throw their focus off maybe just from the immediate response.
If you enjoy what I make, donate to the cause 8) It's very much appreciated!!
Image
DBRider251
Posts: 1638
Joined: Fri Jun 21, 2013 5:38 pm
Team: LCQ Studios

Re: 2021 MX Season

Post by DBRider251 »

137 wrote: Wed Jul 07, 2021 5:09 pm I like the radio in the helmets idea but don’t you think it could potentially cause a distraction? Like imagine being in the zone and next thing is boom “red cross flag coming up” could throw their focus off maybe just from the immediate response.
It doesn't really seem to be a problem in any other motorsport
TeamHavocRacing wrote:it's all the liberals fault
137
Posts: 2599
Joined: Wed Jun 24, 2009 1:31 am
Team: LCQ Studios / rF

Re: 2021 MX Season

Post by 137 »

DBRider251 wrote: Wed Jul 07, 2021 7:01 pm It doesn't really seem to be a problem in any other motorsport
I understand but their not jumping through the air, focusing on landings, transitions through jumps, imagine being focused to hit a whoop section and they hit you with it, I mean I’m on no level of these guys it would probably throw me off but they could more than likely adapt to it and possibly train for it in the offseason
If you enjoy what I make, donate to the cause 8) It's very much appreciated!!
Image
DBRider251
Posts: 1638
Joined: Fri Jun 21, 2013 5:38 pm
Team: LCQ Studios

Re: 2021 MX Season

Post by DBRider251 »

137 wrote: Wed Jul 07, 2021 10:26 pm
DBRider251 wrote: Wed Jul 07, 2021 7:01 pm It doesn't really seem to be a problem in any other motorsport
I understand but their not jumping through the air, focusing on landings, transitions through jumps, imagine being focused to hit a whoop section and they hit you with it, I mean I’m on no level of these guys it would probably throw me off but they could more than likely adapt to it and possibly train for it in the offseason
Rallycross does, albeit in a car with a rollcage, not a bike without.

IIRC, I think riders that used to train at the GOAT farm used radio communication instead of pitboards during the week. It would at least be something interesting to try at like Monster Energy Cup or something similar.
TeamHavocRacing wrote:it's all the liberals fault
Wahlamt
Posts: 7712
Joined: Mon Sep 13, 2010 3:15 pm
Team: MLG Compton
Location: Sweden
Contact:

Re: 2021 MX Season

Post by Wahlamt »

Really surprised they didn't drop a red flag after the pile up before the finish at 250 m2.
DBRider251
Posts: 1638
Joined: Fri Jun 21, 2013 5:38 pm
Team: LCQ Studios

Re: 2021 MX Season

Post by DBRider251 »

If there would have been a serious injury on track, they may have. But where everyone was off track that was hurt, they just flagged
TeamHavocRacing wrote:it's all the liberals fault
KTM57
Posts: 13794
Joined: Wed Jul 07, 2010 2:42 am
Location: TX
Contact:

Re: 2021 MX Season

Post by KTM57 »

I hate to yell into the ether about another person's job, but whoever was in charge of staffing flaggers did a horrible job at Millville. There were like 3 of them along the entire stretch of track between Mt Martin and the finish line. Based on the TV camera angles, I feel like a competent flagger or two could have prevented most of the 250 pileup, and we once again had a stark lack of blue flags. I'm not volunteering, but it's a vital job that has been done very poorly in the outdoor series as of late.
DBRider251
Posts: 1638
Joined: Fri Jun 21, 2013 5:38 pm
Team: LCQ Studios

Re: 2021 MX Season

Post by DBRider251 »

KTM57 wrote: Wed Jul 21, 2021 3:25 pm I hate to yell into the ether about another person's job, but whoever was in charge of staffing flaggers did a horrible job at Millville. There were like 3 of them along the entire stretch of track between Mt Martin and the finish line. Based on the TV camera angles, I feel like a competent flagger or two could have prevented most of the 250 pileup, and we once again had a stark lack of blue flags. I'm not volunteering, but it's a vital job that has been done very poorly in the outdoor series as of late.
A few people who were at the race said the flagger responsible for that section was just sitting there watching it, reacting to it like a fan. Absolutely ridiculous
TeamHavocRacing wrote:it's all the liberals fault
Wahlamt
Posts: 7712
Joined: Mon Sep 13, 2010 3:15 pm
Team: MLG Compton
Location: Sweden
Contact:

Re: 2021 MX Season

Post by Wahlamt »

Not sure what was up, but clearly it wasn't flaggers. Just felt unfair. I if one don't mind pile-ups, but if someone frame cases one of the motorcycles 10s after the initial crash, come on. Not to mention, people still being really close to run into them after 30 seconds... What a mess.
Post Reply