6d helmets.

I've heard conversation coming out of animal pens that is more intelligent than what is going on in here.
MiNi
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Re: 6d helmets.

Post by MiNi »

Evo997 wrote:Look at this picture, this is how your vertebrae move. There are three main ways to break a neck, twist, bend, compress. The two that get addressed by a neck brace are bend, and twist to a lesser degree. Obviously, getting landed on like Trey Canard in 2012 is a compression, and a neck brace will do next to nothing, but maybe a little help because his neck wouldn't have been bent as far over exposing more vertebrae. To be 100% effective would have to be overly restricting. A Leatt is designed to keep your head from moving too far from the original position. Anyone who has worn one understands. It's simple science and the picture alone should let you come to the conclusion yourself. Bend the vertebrae too far in either direction and they fracture.

Saying they do nothing is absolutely ridiculous. Companies would not be investing money and time into making a product better if it didn't work. They'd do what most cheap companies do, make it and say it's perfect; never touching it again. People break their necks, it happens. Majority is a compression, either head first into something or landed on. A neck brace can't help with that. In reality though, it's better to be landed on than have your neck snapped from it getting bent back.
It has been established that neck braces aren't able to prevent compression, yes. It has also been established that any type of equipment is not meant to guarantee any prevention of injury. Your post got me interested as I re-watched the Canard wreck over again. Watching it, you see that Canard mostly takes the impact onto most of his back. I'm not sure if this crash was the best example, since it just looked like this crash didn't require the leatt either way. Meanwhile, Morais had no neck brace and hit the deck head first with a tremendous amount of force to his neck. Aside from his jaw injuries, he broke his C1, C2, C6, C7 and T1. Could a neck brace have prevented those injuries? Could he have been better off with no neck brace? Of course somebody could say the leatt helped regardless. But there have been plenty of riders that have suffered those kinds of injuries even with a leatt. You also can't compare it to Canard's because Canard had a much different impact than Morais. Back to what I said before though;, equipment is not guaranteed to save you. In a way, it remains as a mystery.

I wouldn't say that they do absolutely nothing. 1% means something, but 1% isn't substantial. I also said before that we will never know what really went on in the investment process for the leatt. Maybe leatt wants to seek out the better and innovate it to make it better. Maybe their current model is their base template and all of this is a big test/work in progress (which is what I believe it to be, personally). Its unfortunate to know the danger in the sport and scary to know that safety equipment only does so much to prevent you from harm. I'm not saying any of this because I'm a neck brace hater. I actually support the neck brace, or any sort of neck protection for that matter. I hope the sport can find a way to make substantial neck protection that works. I continued to wear the leatt for 2 years after I heard what I heard, but I didn't ever feel the same about it. I took mine off just out of personal preference. If it wasn't for a high risk in broken collarbones, shoulder injuries, chest injuries and back injuries, I wouldn't ever question wearing one. But all of those injuries are a high price to pay for 1%. The choice between taking and leaving the 1% all comes down to personal preference. The way I see it, I don't blame you for wearing one and I don't blame you for not wearing one.
Phathry25 wrote:Don't try to apply logic to anything mini says. That's where you went wrong.
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BuddyTheElf
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Re: 6d helmets.

Post by BuddyTheElf »

Going for a pre-race piss whilst wearing a leatt and a helmet is a nightmare, you can't even tilt your head forwards enough to see what you're doing. I stopped wearing mine for that reason alone!
MiNi
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Re: 6d helmets.

Post by MiNi »

BuddyTheElf wrote:Going for a pre-race piss whilst wearing a leatt and a helmet is a nightmare, you can't even tilt your head forwards enough to see what you're doing. I stopped wearing mine for that reason alone!
Those were the worst hahahahahaha
Phathry25 wrote:Don't try to apply logic to anything mini says. That's where you went wrong.
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Wilson156
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Re: 6d helmets.

Post by Wilson156 »

MiNi wrote:
BuddyTheElf wrote:Going for a pre-race piss whilst wearing a leatt and a helmet is a nightmare, you can't even tilt your head forwards enough to see what you're doing. I stopped wearing mine for that reason alone!
Those were the worst hahahahahaha
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Phathry25
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Re: 6d helmets.

Post by Phathry25 »

LOL! Small dick problems.
MiNi
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Re: 6d helmets.

Post by MiNi »

Phathry25 wrote:LOL! Small dick problems.
"I can't get it any bigger!"
Phathry25 wrote:Don't try to apply logic to anything mini says. That's where you went wrong.
KTM57 wrote:Total keyboard warrior.
Evo997
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Re: 6d helmets.

Post by Evo997 »

Just ride butt-neked like me. You don't ever have to question gear purchase. Nope. Butt naked... Just let it all hand out and flop in the wind. It's a bit like a dog sticking his head out a window.
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Phathry25 wrote:Don't try to apply logic to anything MiNi says.
ShortyMX
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Re: 6d helmets.

Post by ShortyMX »

So, I've been reading almost every post in this topic now (until the point where the useless discussion between phat and mini)
To start it off: I've had the opportunity to talk to Bobryshev at the MXGP of Bastogne. I've asked him why he stopped wearing a neckbrace like so many other pros, for example Cairoli, Dungey and many others. He told me, that it wasn't comfortable for him and breathing was very hard with it. This confused me a little, I mean you can adjust a Leatt a lot, and he was a sponsored rider, so why did they not just make it bigger? Anyway, he also added that in that time he wore a chestprotector which wasn't compatible with the leatt.

To the 1% thingy: http://youtu.be/FD6-NDswsdk (9:07) Here you can see a test with a dummy, with a leatt and without. I don't know how it just can prevent a neck injury in 1 of 100 cases.
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ShortyMX
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Re: 6d helmets.

Post by ShortyMX »

This confuses me most: Many riders stopped riding it (Dungey, Reed, Cairoli, Stewart wore it too once, Bogle, almost everyone), but on the other side big crashes where it looks like the leatt prevented an injury (Ramon, various amateurs). Soo paradoy
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Del
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Re: 6d helmets.

Post by Del »

I'd like to know exactly how many times you've said "1%" throughout this thread, MiNi. I already know exactly how many times you've provided a legitimate source for that statistic.
Phathry25
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Re: 6d helmets.

Post by Phathry25 »

GRANT LANGSTON!
760Liam
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Re: 6d helmets.

Post by 760Liam »

Thank you Shorty! We can now end this discussion.
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MiNi
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Re: 6d helmets.

Post by MiNi »

Del wrote:I'd like to know exactly how many times you've said "1%" throughout this thread, MiNi. I already know exactly how many times you've provided a legitimate source for that statistic.
In the end, it is only hearsay. For all you know, what I've said could be total bullshit, or it could be 100% true. But you don't have to believe everything you hear, as you can choose what you want to believe in. The hearsay that you hear from your friends is as believable as you make it to be. If Grant Langston told me to jump off a bridge because there's no reason to live, I wouldn't listen to it because it doesn't make any sense to do it, I have a million reasons not to and common knowledge can tell me that it would be retarded. If Grant Langston told me that neck braces are a giant scam and they don't work, I can choose to believe it, but only if I think it makes sense. Based on what he told me, I personally think that his theory/argument makes sense, even though it is only his opinion. As for the statistic itself (assuming it even exists), good luck finding or getting it.

You may be thinking that this is an issue of getting starstruck; which it isn't, as I've had the luxury of living with top pro riders before. I can assure you that I handle getting starstruck a lot better than the average rider that blows their load when they see a guy with a pro license. While a guy like Langston is not a doctor, I can still trust his opinion because he knows and can get information from many different "higher-up" sources. There is also the possibility of him telling things privately that he doesn't want the general public to know.

But regardless, this is only my opinion. I'm not out to shove it in your face, I'm not out to make you wrong for having a counter or an opposite opinion and I'm not out to make you look like a fool. I was just sharing my opinion as Prodigy asked for it. I only put it out there as information for an educational purpose. My opinion is solely based off what I have heard and what I know. Take it or leave it; I don't blame you for either decision.
Phathry25 wrote:Don't try to apply logic to anything mini says. That's where you went wrong.
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