*** Official "Too dumb to read the forum rules" topic ***

[jeremy103]

I won't speak for all of the ones you mentioned but many have dicussed this topic with me, and from what I understand if there was a legit secure way, things would be much diffrent around here. Kinda fucked up when a creator has to feel like they have to release all or nothing, and if they don't they get screwed over.

I don't however, like this "$5 and ill put your name/# on a set a gear that has more time into it than I can imagine" stuff that has been a trend lately. Really wish jlv would have a modified moderator group that can move/delete topics and nothing else. Would help organize snd bring the noobness level down a bit around here.

I know what you are talking about because I believe I was there too lol. But I feel like they are doing that because everything has now turned into a money fest. I personally don't think it should be like that. I believe I heard you say one time that you model because you like to do it and you want the bike to look the way you want it to, not to get 150 bucks out of everyone. I just feel it should be a free environment. They put a lot of time and effort into the tracks just like the models people make, but the only difference is they don't ask for money to release the track, but the modelers do. (Not saying you Mason <3) I mean we are a community. We should help make the game look/feel better. It should be people making sick tracks and gear/bikes without having to pay. But it's turning into a "dlc" (where you have to pay) pack from Alive just to get good looking stuff.

[John23]

Wow.....$3?

1. Whoever pays for skins are dumbasses
2. Why so cheap? If someone does it for free (me), it means we just like doing it. If you charge as little as $3, it's gotta be shit skinning.
3. Maybe post some pics of your work first before you ask for money.

[jrobiscool1996]

theres really no need to be swearing act your age and grow up

[Evo997]

Sooo... If it's as cheap as $3 it's crap. But if it's free it's quality? You'd be an excellent salesman

[jrobiscool1996]

and jer the reason why I was asking for 3$ is cause it takes hours for me to do graphics and I mean I didn't know you guys would get so but hurt over that one post youre acting like im ask 10$ for a god dam dirtbike no im not, its funny how ive seen people make money on her makin graphics for way way way more money so id just let this one go not worth arguing about if it makes you feel good inside ill just delete the firkin post little cry baby

[jrobiscool1996]

and id put more than a name and number on a bike........

[Evo997]

The difference is what this game is. This game is entirely community based. Without the community the game wouldn't be what it is. The community creates tracks for free. Which takes far more time than a graphic. The community creates models; which, again, takes far longer than skinning. If those two things are being created for the community to enjoy individually; then it makes no sense to charge for one of the least time consuming things in the game. If some people are dumb enough to pay someone to make graphics then all power to the conman. If it's something you like doing, then do it because of that, not because it's a fast way to make a couple dollars.

Of course this is essentially what everyone else has been trying to say.

[dbaum25moto]

The community creates models; which, again, takes far longer than skinning.

This is the only part I disagree with. Models RARELY ever just get released, They usually have a kickstarter to them, or you have to buy them individually. That is Kind of Bullshit. I know it took you tons of hours to make these models, but damn, 10 grand!!! (m21c1) Its a 40 dollar video game i think i wouldnt want to put too much more into it

[m121c]

No where did I say $10k. If I got payed a normal wage for the hours ive put in it, that would be the end result.

And squid, you are complety correct with what you said. The thing many seem to ignore is the fact I support free content. I don't support expected and a sence of entitlement towards source files. Personally, my honda source files will not be available publicly without a kickstarter or something of that nature. Like me, hate me, idc I could keep it to myself for all I care, I model for myself out of enjoyment but the source files are what make it mine. To me that is worth more than free no matter if its for a $40 video game or not.

Not to say I'll never release packs for free, there will be free packs. Unfortunately that doesn't seem to be enough around here, but I dont really care.

[Wahlamt]

The community creates models; which, again, takes far longer than skinning.

This is the only part I disagree with. Models RARELY ever just get released.

I think he means that 1 model takes longer time to make rather than 1 skin.

[Beast2013]

Sooo... If it's as cheap as $3 it's crap. But if it's free it's quality? You'd be an excellent salesman

I like this one

[Evo997]

No where did I say $10k. If I got payed a normal wage for the hours ive put in it, that would be the end result.

I call bullshit on this. As an artist and tattoo artist I've spend weeks planning, drawing, and working on a single piece of permanent art. I understand how time consuming things can be, believe me; some of that stuff takes about a year to perfect. Contrary to popular belief though; tattoo artists make very little money. The prices are to keep a shop open and to keep people getting the art they want. I have more than one job, besides tattooing, because of the prices. What shop are you keeping open to model or skin something for a game that isn't even widely known or liked; and may get used for a year or slightly longer? It may be great work put out by the artists doing these, but if you're doing it on your own time; why would you charge for it if there are no expenses to do it?

I think he means that 1 model takes longer time to make rather than 1 skin.

You are correct, sir

Sooo... If it's as cheap as $3 it's crap. But if it's free it's quality? You'd be an excellent salesman

I like this one

Thx bbg <3

[m121c]

I call bullshit on this. As an artist and tattoo artist I've spend weeks planning, drawing, and working on a single piece of permanent art. I understand how time consuming things can be, believe me; some of that stuff takes about a year to perfect. Contrary to popular belief though; tattoo artists make very little money. The prices are to keep a shop open and to keep people getting the art they want. I have more than one job, besides tattooing, because of the prices. What shop are you keeping open to model or skin something for a game that isn't even widely known or liked; and may get used for a year or slightly longer? It may be great work put out by the artists doing these, but if you're doing it on your own time; why would you charge for it if there are no expenses to do it?

As I quoted in another thread:

I will throw out a figure of $10,000. Now I will explain this because that seems like ton just for some silly (I say that lightly) video game models but in reality it's actually a really low goal.

On the Honda I estimate to have around 250 hours put into this thing when I am done. I have not been recording just estimating, I will also use $25/hr for this calculation. As a free lancer this is low, and as a professional this is low. I am neither of those so that is why it is low, I just came up with that amount just due to the fact I know what it takes to make all this and that is what I think it is worth.

Bikes - 250hrs x $25 = $6,250 x 6 bikes = $37,500
Gear - 40 hours each x $25 = $1,000 X 5 = $5,000

All together - $42,000


Of course even with a low hourly wage it would still be quiet a bit of money. The model you see for other games like MVA, MXGP, etc. where made in much less time, probably 40 hours each if that, but they are also not as detailed and they work in teams. I would assume most of their parts are modular as well,what I mean by that is they use the same forks, handlebars, footpegs, etc. over and over on each bike where as this Honda has nothing on it that was modeled before.

In my opinion source files are worth more than free and nothing anyone says can change that. It is what makes my work mine, and the only way for me personally to be alright with letting go of it is if I make some money off it. Until then, I could honestly enjoy my creation, as I modeled it for myself anyways, and just release packs to be honest.

As a tattoo artist, let's say you have a book of tattoo design sketches drawn by yourself, now would you release those drawings for free for other artists to tattoo off it and not mention who the designs actually came from? Or how about if they profit off of your design? All knowing that the only thing that links you to those designs being yours is that book you had, but now plenty of others have it also. You just have to look at things in perspective... I mean some people may be completely fine with it, I am not one of those people. If you are one those artists/people that really doesn't care good on you.

[Evo997]

I guess that is where the dichotomy occurs. My designs are readily available to other artists that ask for them. Some months I make so little money off art that I pay to do it as opposed to earn from it. I love creating for people to have; ignorantly of myself I assumed amateur creators would have the same mentality with greed being unavailing. Sometimes I forget how people have abundant vainglory, and it's a little disappointing.

[Tressler27]

Im making a 6d and i dont know how to use the cut out or how to save it. Also how to put goggles on the helmet.I want to try to put oakley airbrakes on there but i dont know how to. If you can help at all please do